Especially when you have kids and realize that many local gov't decisions are based on who is in office (think of their education). I used to hate politicians and the whole "voting" thing taught from the cult. Then I realized I have a duty to better my community by voting locally. Congrats.
Haulin Oats
JoinedPosts by Haulin Oats
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Registered to Vote...
by PYRAMIDSCHEME ini registered to vote today.
it all came from my political science class i am taking in college.
the more i heard the more i wanted to vote.
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Counselled on chatting to a study!
by Penn9 inhey all, i'm new to posting, but i've lurked for a while.
quick intro: i'm a 25 yr old guy, brought up a jw, strayed for a while, then got baptized convinced it was the best thing for me, the rest of the world is satanic, etc.
i overcame that ridiculous belief and i know the truth about "the truth" but my friends and family are all deep into the cult so leaving is a huge risk that i'm not willing or ready to take.
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Haulin Oats
If she's attracted to the "high-morals" of the JW's I'd be leery. Sounds like she's coming from a low-moral past....maybe she was exposed to some stuff that really shocked her and scarred her for life and this squeaky-clean band-of-salesmen/women is appealing to her? Even if she's hot as Selma Hayek, be careful. Even if you can play Indiana Jones to her Marion and rescue her from the clutches of the evil JWs, you may be stuck with someone with a deep emotionally troubled past. Is it worth the battle? Only you can decide.
I mean this with all sincerity. The girl is probably great stuff. I will say this: People will do what they want to do. Either she will be gung-ho about the cult, or isn't really honest with herself about why she needs to find religion and will soon falter after joining. Either way, how she deals with her own sincerity about something she loves/believes/cherishes will be the same way how she deals with you. For all you know, she could be running away from something. My .02 pesos is to get to know her first outside the hall. Make your encounters non-religious. God-speed to you Penn.
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In the next ten years the JW "history" will only extend back to 2000
by sinis ingiven current statistics with regards to attrition in the jw ranks, it becomes appearant that we are seeing the unfolding of the early 20th century with regards to the teachings of the jw's late 19th century.
with fewer and fewer old timers hanging on, and the influx of young or newbies, it is becoming quite clear that these newcomers ~5 maybe even ten years in... have no clue about the foundations of 1914, 1919 inspection, etc or the failed attempts of end of days, ie 1975, etc.
i believe this is what the gb are banking on!!!
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Haulin Oats
It'll happen. When the vintage physical publications become rare as hen's teeth, the sheep will only have the CD-ROM to feed off of. JW kids will be even more lazy and won't want to dig that deep for the real truth. Pretty soon, the JW website will be the portal to the internet for ALL of their followers; think "watchtower.google.com". Cleaned up and safe from the apostate thinking, the portal will only allow good wholesome information. Remember that Yellow pages catchline? "Let your elders do the thinking".
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Did Jesus make wine or grape juice
by jam inproverbs 23;31-33, commands, "do not look on the wine when it is red,.
when it sparkles in the cup and goes down smoothly.
bites like a serpent, and stings like an adder (viper).
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Haulin Oats
I asked a mormon guy I worked with why they don't drink but yet Jesus (their leader in part) turned water in to wine. He said it was grape-juice not wine. Ok. So last time i checked, Welch's never made me hallucinate or see visions. I wonder what he would have said if I asked him what HE thought Jesus made at the festival.... Oh, well. You can't save 'em all.
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Ever do drugs while in the organization?
by FifthOfNovember ini only ever drank while i was still attending meetings.
but i seriously considered trying lsd or shrooms.
i came really close to trying shrooms once with my friend but we never got around to calling someone to sell us some.
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Haulin Oats
I went to the book-studies in the KH while stoned out of my mind. This was when I was df'd. Even stoned, I still didn't really believe any of it. Maybe thats a sign? I can tell you that a few tokes of the Mary and I'm able to think alot more clearly. Once I had a family, I went to the meetings buzzed on beer plenty of times. Again, it didn't make the pills any easier to swallow. I did however have an elder tell me that he was able to become a MS after he laid off the beer, implying that I should do the same. I went home and tossed a few back that night. So much for that.
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Did you miss out on "higher education" when a JW but go to college later?
by Mad Sweeney ini did.
still not finished with a degree yet but i'll get there.. how about you?.
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Haulin Oats
I went. English 101 was THE greatest class in the universe (that and a communications class). It was there I discovered the world of reasoning/logical thinking. I never finished my degree, but its inevitable if I wish to move up with my current company. Meh. At least I don't have to worry about taking time away for "spiritual things". When I was an active JW, the only option was to either install flooring with my ol' man, or go to diesel mechanic school. <Cringes>
I liken the frequency of WTBTS study to someone who HAS to double check that the grass is still green every couple of days. YES, ITS STILL GREEN, you don't have to study a book 3 times a week to reinforce the color of grass. You could forget about it for 6 months and still know that its green. Just relax..... Else, Satan might plant the seeds of doubt that its really orange grass out there...God help us! ORANGE GRASS!
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Hello from NW USA
by Haulin Oats inhey there, gang.. i'm haulin oats.
i came to full awareness recently after finding a work-mate who also had "seen the light" finally.. i was born/raised a jw, having made some pretty big sacrifices in the name of the organization, even moving to where the need was greater before the start of high school.
needless to say, small mid-west farm towns don't look too highly on jw's.
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Haulin Oats
I don't find it scary at all. "What can man do to me?" Exciting of course!
Yeah the whole music thing was pretty amazing. You never knew what music was going to be labled "debasing" that week.
This is a great story I must share:
In the mid-west, we had our share of elders who came to give the talk each week from afar (our congregation was about 25 people). We were assigned hospitality for this one particular elder after the meeting was over. Essentially a meal and some chit-chat for the weary speaker and his family before heading home. After the late lunch meal my mother had prepared (often the elders ate better than our own family did at our house), my parents and the elder and his wife hung out in the living room talking about whatever. I decided to retire to my room and put on some Jimi Hendrix (Electric Ladyland). After about 45 minutes of zoning out to Jimi (no drugs involved), my dad came storming in and asked to see the tape I was listening to; I thought that he was going to take the tape and show the elder that his son (me) listens to classic rock in the early 90's. NO. My dad ended up breaking it in half with his bare hands, and then stated "this is debasing music", and left the room.
Jesus H-Monkey-on-a-stick Christ, was I pissed! That elder had been filling my dad's head with a bunch of nonsense lies about the music choices that kids of the day had to pick from (this was in the early 90's). And being the sheep my dad was, he decided to show the elder that he was a fine, upstanding witless with a family. My Jimi tape got smashed up because of the "theory" that it was bad music, all based on the lies this elder told my dad. An FYI, it was my own father who first told me about Jimi so there you go.
Needless to say, I didn't let sleeping dogs lie. I went outside right after that, telling my parents I was going to ride my bike to a withness friends house across town and hang out. Instead, I went into his truck where he had a tape of a band he REALLY liked, Maxi Priest. Some type of jazz, easy listening. I grabbed that tape and proceeded to smash that bastard up against the truck bumper with my foot. God I smashed it to bits. There was absolutely nothing left. I felt satisfied that I had retaliated "tit for tat".
For many years after that, he'd always ask us kids "have you seen my Maxi Priest tape?". "Uh, no dad. never even heard of it....what's it look like?" He'd mumble something then take 30 minutes to rummage in the basement for it, swearing that he'd left it down there at some point.
Fast forward to the early 2000's. I had to come clean with my father about this silly tape bullshit. So I told him: "Do you remember that elder that came over for hospitality? And remember what he told you about music?" My dad acknowledged the elders monumental visit that fateful sunday afternoon, and remembered the discussion. I then told him that I smashed the hell out of his Maxi tape cause he smashed my Jimi tape. I said I didn't think that Jimi was any worse than some Jazz band. He acknowledged that he'd over-reacted to what he was hearing from the elder. Gee, thanks dad. Way to keep your cool and logically think stuff out before reacting.
I never lost another tape via smashing/cracking again. My dad left me alone regarding music.
Remember the buddy I went and visited after my dad smashed Jimi? This same elder had another talk in our hall and my buddy's family had them for hospitality a few months after my debacle. This time the elders wife told my buddy that if he listened to Jethro Tull, that it would make him gay. She said her brother was a homo and he was a big Jethro Tull fan and that her parents had determined that the music of Ian Anderson's band was the cause of it all. Hence the logic was so clear to her, it was her duty to warn others of this hurtful band's music and their message of gayness. Naturally his parents lapped all this crap right up. We had to both hide our music tapes for several months after this. We were (and still are) HUGE Tull fans.
To whomever is reading this: I am not making this up! I am totally serious. Yes its funny, yes these people are sometimes labeled as a cult...but I was THERE. I heard people telling me what was good for me based on some experience they had ONCE or had heard thru a congregation. Sadly, my buddy made it all the way to bethel (because it was the bullshit goal his mother-hen mom had drilled into his head from his childhood). He is now an elder and still likes Jethro Tull. So do I. I'm going to see that band perform this spring; and you bet your sweet butts that I'm going to think about that time he was told that the music would make him gay.
"Nothing is easy" (a Tull song) definitely rang true for me and my buddy growing up. Jesus Christ, leave us alone! We had already gave up city life, and had endured persecution at school constantly. Don't take away the last refuge we had in escaping this world for just a little bit which was music. Nope, they had to take that away also.
End rant.
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Freddy Franz' Unrestrained Mind Control
by Alfred innowadays, the wt knows that it needs to tread gently when they execute their mind control tactics... modern jws now have iphones, facebook and better access to information in general.
so their approach needs to be as subtle as possible.... jws in the 50s and 60s, on the other hand, had nothing but freddys ongoing barrage of guilt-inducing wt articles.
heres a small sample of what jws were exposed to during that time.... ...we shall march forth organized theocratically, knowing organization procedures.
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Haulin Oats
Lols @ Kurt! Brilliant video. I think if you substitute the word "Kingdom" for "Mind", it'll hit the nail on the head. Hey theres a guy named Jim Jones who had some good ideas.... :)
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Hello from NW USA
by Haulin Oats inhey there, gang.. i'm haulin oats.
i came to full awareness recently after finding a work-mate who also had "seen the light" finally.. i was born/raised a jw, having made some pretty big sacrifices in the name of the organization, even moving to where the need was greater before the start of high school.
needless to say, small mid-west farm towns don't look too highly on jw's.
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Haulin Oats
Wow, thanks guys. Definitely a big support group here.
I'm in the east side of WA state (and thats about as specific as I want to get for now).
I went on a walk today with the wife, and boy was it nice. I was able to ask her viewpoints on various things we've discussed regarding breaking free. She mentioned that she will likely have a hard time with her mom who is very much "in the truth". But her husband is an unbeliever. My wife's mom may have an issue, or she may not even care that we've left. We'll see. Honestly it's none of her damn business, but you know how the witlesses get when a sheep strays....
@oompa, you may want to introduce your wife to the magical world of "logical fallacies". Thats how I was able to plant the seeds (or uproot the weeds?) with my wife. Wikipedia is full of examples of fallacious thinking; pick some popular ones and point them out in the newspaper or media outlets and ask her opinion. Once you find one she recognizes, its time to find a similar fallacious vein of reasoning that the cult uses. Find a WT article loaded with BS reasoning that she will be able to recognize, and mention that you found it interesting. From there, its simply shooting fish in a barrel. Its really tough to discredit logical thinking; and since we're exposed to it nearly everyday (even outside of religion), its not hard to come up with hundreds of examples of incorrect thought-processes.
Thanks to "the truth", I have a keen ability to draw analogies for just about anything so people can understand them. My wife isn't necessarily the academic type (I consider her pretty fragile), so i have to explain things so she'll understand easily. I am fair in my analogies often asking unbiased questions. I want this to be her decision, and not be the asshole husband that MADE her leave the religion. It shouldn't be too hard tho.
I really appreciate the warm welcome to this board. I remember going to various different KH's randomly and never getting this kind of welcome when I walked in the door.
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Hello from NW USA
by Haulin Oats inhey there, gang.. i'm haulin oats.
i came to full awareness recently after finding a work-mate who also had "seen the light" finally.. i was born/raised a jw, having made some pretty big sacrifices in the name of the organization, even moving to where the need was greater before the start of high school.
needless to say, small mid-west farm towns don't look too highly on jw's.
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Haulin Oats
Hey there, gang.
I'm Haulin Oats. I came to full awareness recently after finding a work-mate who also had "seen the light" finally.
I was born/raised a JW, having made some pretty big sacrifices in the name of the organization, even moving to where the need was greater before the start of high school. Needless to say, small mid-west farm towns don't look too highly on JW's. But it was here in the mid-west where my doubts were sown due to the vast amount of crazy shit I saw growing up there. My parents survived 1975 with their blinders fully intact. They skated right through that period drinking VAST amounts of Kool-aid. Both are pretty much inactive now, but I have suspicions that they stopped really caring about religion years ago.
I have no interest in religion, period. I hated dressing up on Sundays, often missing ball-games or car races. I hated going to meetings because I had better things to do with my time after school/work.
One of my blood-sisters was the first from our family to jump ship. I've taken alot of her example and its really helped me to get out of this nonsensical organization. I have made it very clear to my wife that i'm not going back ever again. The wife has since started to ask me to help her see the flaws in the cult. I showed her the child abuse information that Barb had on her site. This helped my wife to start questioning what else is screwed up in this cult. We now have "evening studies" of articles from websites like Barb's and others. We spend time together learning how to think for ourselves. I love it.
I hope to establish some relationships as a member of this board. I plan to post about my teenaged daughter who is still hooked into "the machine". I've made some progress with her, but hope that I can get some good ideas to help her see the light. I'll make a separate post about her later.
Anyhow, Im glad to be here.
Oh, and my username stems from my days as a youth; being told that the pop band "hall & oates" were demonic/debasing because someone in the hall "just had a feeling they are". Riiiiiiiiight......